Friday, September 3rd 2010, 7:04pm UTC+1

You are not logged in.

  • Login
  • Register

Are divings boats worth the research?

  • 1
  • 2

Forte

Famous Leader

Date of registration: Apr 28th 2008

Posts: 1,573

1

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 5:26pm

Are divings boats worth the research?

Since mortar ships have better attack, and are used more often in terms of defense, is researching divings boats really worth the amount of gold lost?

Afterlife - Exia - Alpha
  • Go to the top of the page

Sore25

Wealthy Conqueror

Date of registration: Jun 26th 2008

Posts: 777

2

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 5:29pm

Diving boats have the defence bonus which makes the them one of the better units for defence. It all depends on what the player wants to get.

I think they are worth the reaserch.
On Eta [Seda_Wolf-Lone Wolves-LWS] and Theta [Sore-F-UIN]



Awsome sig and ava done by PhoEniX Rising
  • Go to the top of the page

dreadlord

Governor

Date of registration: Feb 25th 2008

Posts: 301

Gender: male

3

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 5:55pm

i agree solid def :agree: useless if you want to move them though
  • Go to the top of the page

Forte

Famous Leader

Date of registration: Apr 28th 2008

Posts: 1,573

4

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 5:59pm

Quoted from "dreadlord"

i agree solid def :agree: useless if you want to move them though


I'm just wondering.

In case of a blockade will they pack enough punch to destroy?

And then wouldn't I have to build level 15 ports in all my towns?

Afterlife - Exia - Alpha
  • Go to the top of the page

15 Mexicans

Governor

Date of registration: Mar 5th 2008

Posts: 445

Gender: male

Location: Burying your treasure, burning your crops

5

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 6:07pm

I think they are worth it. I use a mix of diving boats and mortor ships to defend. I figure the extra def numbers of the diving boats will let my mortors live longer to kill more attackers.

I haven't been attacked yet to see how well they work though.
I close my eyes every time I pull the trigger
  • Go to the top of the page

dreadlord

Governor

Date of registration: Feb 25th 2008

Posts: 301

Gender: male

6

Wednesday, August 27th 2008, 6:34pm

yeh they do pack a fair punch but are so slooowww.....
  • Go to the top of the page

MeowC

Student

Date of registration: Aug 17th 2008

Posts: 32

7

Thursday, August 28th 2008, 8:27am

http://www.focusedgaming.com/ikariam/146…ts-ikariam.html

I can't see the point in building them and am not planning to. You get about twice as much attack and defense power for the same amount of resources by building ballista ships, which also have resistance. They are slow. And their stats per upkeep are on par with ballista ships. So a few more might survive in a battle. But to me that doesn't outweight:

2x as expensive upfront costs as ballistas for the same stats (w/ lumber:sulphur:crystal valued as 1:2:2 respectively)
no better upkeep/stats than ballistas
can't be moved/useless for attacking
ports have to be upgraded
costs 140k crystals for 3/3 upgrades
uses crystals for production which are more valuable than sulphur

I don't see the point in bothering. Phalanx, ballistas, and flamethrowers are the only units in the game worth building imo.
  • Go to the top of the page

GO+Mod

Date of registration: Jun 16th 2008

Posts: 273

Birthday: Dec 3rd 1996 (13)

Gender: male

Location: Guernsey,Channel islands

Occupation: School

8

Thursday, August 28th 2008, 8:59am

why do ports have to be upgraded
Join the Asgard Assassins

Ranked 141th but rising steadily
Friendly
Elite

Ny's greatest alliance!

From the Founding Fathers of the Skyhawks in Iota
  • Go to the top of the page

15 Mexicans

Governor

Date of registration: Mar 5th 2008

Posts: 445

Gender: male

Location: Burying your treasure, burning your crops

9

Thursday, August 28th 2008, 12:46pm

Quoted from "Robbicus the 2nd"

why do ports have to be upgraded

I'm thinking they mean shipyards. I'm ok with that because I had planned on upgrading to the soft cap anyway to get the fastest build time.

I like being able to make an army/navy quickly if I need to.
I close my eyes every time I pull the trigger
  • Go to the top of the page

Eliteforce

Governor

Date of registration: May 17th 2008

Posts: 398

Gender: male

10

Thursday, August 28th 2008, 2:12pm

Hint: Diving boats have 2 stamina.


2 stamina sucks. Baaaaaaaadly. In a 3 round battle they'd already have half-stamina most likely.... That's why I don't and won't use them, mortar ships are good for me.
Ikariam.org- Zeta
Returned from the dead of N F
Yes, I can solve those.
  • Go to the top of the page

JaeRoler

Emperor

Date of registration: Mar 7th 2008

Posts: 1,329

11

Thursday, August 28th 2008, 3:02pm

Quoted from "Eliteforce"

Hint: Diving boats have 2 stamina.


2 stamina sucks. Baaaaaaaadly. In a 3 round battle they'd already have half-stamina most likely.... That's why I don't and won't use them, mortar ships are good for me.


They have a Stamina of 10 actually.
  • Go to the top of the page

Eliteforce

Governor

Date of registration: May 17th 2008

Posts: 398

Gender: male

12

Friday, August 29th 2008, 12:35am

*headbang*

Do not post when you're tired. xD Speed of 2. stamina of 10. Sorry bout that... I can't stand slow ships, so I'm not going to use them. I can see how they're decent though if you don't do much with ships. I'll stick to my PWR's and Mortars please =D
Ikariam.org- Zeta
Returned from the dead of N F
Yes, I can solve those.
  • Go to the top of the page

Irontygre

Emperor

Date of registration: Mar 14th 2008

Posts: 1,086

Birthday: Mar 27th 1985 (25)

Gender: male

Location: Boulder, CO, USA

Occupation: Software Developer, Student

13

Friday, August 29th 2008, 4:43am

Ballistas are pretty much in every way shape and form superior to diving boats. The only thing diving boats have going for them is that they cost crystal instead of sulphur. So if you're some freak of nature that has a sulphur shortage, that's an advantage, otherwise /shrug.


Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

- Epicurus
  • Go to the top of the page

Eliteforce

Governor

Date of registration: May 17th 2008

Posts: 398

Gender: male

14

Friday, August 29th 2008, 5:16am

Ballistas aren't completely superior, I'd have mortars and PWR's over ballista's because of how much you have to replace the darn things >_<
Ikariam.org- Zeta
Returned from the dead of N F
Yes, I can solve those.
  • Go to the top of the page

Irontygre

Emperor

Date of registration: Mar 14th 2008

Posts: 1,086

Birthday: Mar 27th 1985 (25)

Gender: male

Location: Boulder, CO, USA

Occupation: Software Developer, Student

15

Friday, August 29th 2008, 5:55am

Ehh, maybe PWRs. Although Mortars are just too painfully slow imo. I find that ballistas and flamers are more than enough to dispatch any sort of navy forces I have to deal with.


Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

- Epicurus
  • Go to the top of the page

MeowC

Student

Date of registration: Aug 17th 2008

Posts: 32

16

Friday, August 29th 2008, 6:15am

I would agree with this idea of mixing units *if* I had seen a single bit of evidence that lots of little units act as a damage sponge preventing the deaths of the larger and much more expensive per stat units.

http://ikariamlibrary.com/?content=IkaFight

Just ran a battle of 200 gunmen and 20 steamgiants (attackers) vs 285 gunmen (defenders).

A typical first round would involve

Attacker units:

200 (-30) gunmen
20 (-4) steamgiants

Defender:
285 (-35) gunmen

You would think logically that the attacker should lose a lower percentage of steam giants in the first round because they are high defense units with twice the armor spread among 10 times more units with very little in armor. This would be the case if all hits were assigned to the opposing military randomly, so there is no mistake in thinking this.

But the game mechanics do not appear to support this logical function. Spend some time with the combat simulator and the game appears to kill off an equal percentage of each unit type every round. I would strongly recommend diving boats *if* they had higher survivability as a result of them being hidden in swarms of lower level units. But this is not how it appears to work. It appears attack and defense values are calculated for each side each round. And then an approximately equal percentage of each different unit type is killed in combat. There is clearly some random variability introduced so that its not exactly equal %'s each round, but on average it is the tendency.

So mixing unit types does not increase survivability of the really big and expensive ones like steam giants and diving boats. The only thing I look at for military units is attack + defense / upkeep. And attack + defense / training cost. You can train a huge swarm of little units for the price of a few big ones. And because phalanx, ballistas, and flamethrowers all have lower attack + defense / training ratios and upkeep ratios, you will be able to buy and send an army with far higher attack and defense values for the same amount of gold and resources. And attacking with overwhelming numbers enormously reduces combat losses.

http://board.ikariam.com/thread.php?threadid=7540
http://www.focusedgaming.com/ikariam/146…ts-ikariam.html

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "MeowC" (Aug 29th 2008, 6:20am)

  • Go to the top of the page

Eliteforce

Governor

Date of registration: May 17th 2008

Posts: 398

Gender: male

17

Friday, August 29th 2008, 1:23pm

Quoted from "Irontygre"

Ehh, maybe PWRs. Although Mortars are just too painfully slow imo. I find that ballistas and flamers are more than enough to dispatch any sort of navy forces I have to deal with.
I only use mortars for defense.

To the person above me, attacking in a huge swarm of ballistas will still give you quite a few losses since it doesn't take much to kill them. I don't know though, depending on how active you blockade ports they may be effective for you.
Ikariam.org- Zeta
Returned from the dead of N F
Yes, I can solve those.
  • Go to the top of the page

Sundance

Governor

Date of registration: Apr 17th 2008

Posts: 307

18

Friday, August 29th 2008, 4:40pm

Normally flame ships are the best ships, figures, you're attacking ships that are made out of wood and sulphur :rolleyes:
Diving boats on the other hand are made out of wood and crystal, also the flame ship's flames don't work under water :whistling:
  • Go to the top of the page

username person

Governor

Date of registration: Jul 16th 2008

Posts: 351

Location: Planet Earth

Occupation: I'm only 11!

19

Friday, August 29th 2008, 4:53pm

They use greek fire, smart one. But yes, flamers rule. Catapults for defence untill you get motars, then have Divers. SO have motars ready to move from colony to colonly, and permantly garrison diving boats.

Quoted


How to keep Idiots busy

read the line below

read the line above

But what if the "Idiot" reads them but doesn't do as it says?
  • Go to the top of the page

Xetor

Student

Date of registration: Mar 16th 2008

Posts: 42

Birthday: Jan 16th 1985 (25)

Gender: male

Location: Russia

Occupation: IT-Consulting

20

Friday, August 29th 2008, 6:31pm

This in fact a very interesting question that I haven't actually decided for myself yet... In fact, the question may be put in this way: should one rather rely on stronger units, or on large quantities of weaker ones? For land units, I am pretty sure that SGs are best defense in the long, though phalanx are nearly as effective, but for offense - when a major offensive punch is needed, swordsmen are your best bet. You can build them quick and cheap and in overwhelming numbers, and they are cheap enough to spare without regret.
But back to the ship. Ballistas have the advantage of greater speed as well as protection bonus... while diving boats are practically immobile. I personally think that keeping a military solely for defense is a waste of money... better keep your port low and save money. I do keep several mortars, though, just in case, but mainly I rely on ballistas which I can move pretty quickly when they are needed for attack. And as for their low durability... well, they are so cheap that I don't care.
So this is the strategy I use, but in fact I am not totally sure of it yet..
Anything that happens, happens.
Anything that, in happening, causes something else to happen, causes something else to happen.
Anything that, in happening, causes itself to happen again, happens again.
It doesn’t do it in chronological order, though.
(с) Douglas Adams "Mostly harmless"
  • Go to the top of the page
  • 1
  • 2

Similar threads